CRM Is Dead. Long Live CRM?

Bob Thompson
Founder, CRMGuru.com
Member

Posted 20-Jan-2005 08:51 AM

Question:
We are in the process of launching CRMGuru's annual conference and I've had some interesting discussions with our guru panel about what to call the event and the pros and cons of using the term "CRM."

Some of our gurus say their clients prefer that they not use the term CRM because of the negative press it's received the past few years. Others say "customer management" is more acceptable—a way to say CRM without actually using those three little letters. And still others, especially outside North America, wonder what all the fuss is about.

What is your opinion about the term CRM? Please complete the following poll and/or write in your comments

Thanks!

Choices:
CRM is still the right term
We don't use the term "CRM" due to negative publicity
Let's use "customer management" instead
Don't care about this issue

Bob Thompson
Founder, CRMGuru.com

Simone Oltolina
Member
Picture of Simone Oltolina

Posted 20-Jan-2005 01:23 PM
yes, CRM got a lot of bad press in the past (partly because the very same press built unrealistic expectations about its supposed benefits) and I know well, from personal experiences, that many executives frown at the mention of the very word so maybe changing term wouldn't be such a bad idea. Still, "customer management" doesn't sound very good to me.... maybe, "building better relationships with your customers", or something along those lines would be a better choice (I see the term "relationship" as central). Of course, that's not an acronym but as a title for a conference I think it wouldn't fare too bad. Maybe you could add something to stress the other flip of the coin (that is, better relationships lead to improved returns):

"building better relationships with your customers...at a profit".

anyway, I'm too prolix myself ;-)

On the other hand: two quick observations: changing terms could generate further confusion (and there is confusion aplenty already in the CRM arena, not two people seem to share the same definition....). People more or less know "intuitively" what CRM is and once they see that word in the conference's title, they'll instatly recognize it as something they could be interested in or not (third-degree targeting?). So this is one point in favour of the "stick-to-the-old-term" approach.

and: suppose people get the feeling you're hiding the nature of your conference (which comes down to CRM) under a different, misleading, term. What would the reaction be? (it's like a the case of a firm, known for bad practices, that re-opens under a new name). I'm not saying that there is something wrong or shameful in working in the CRM field, far from it, I'm just speculating (bizarre fantasies, to be sure) about possible reactions. You and other gurus are certainly able to evaluate the weight of those remarks better than I could:-)

good work:-)

Richard Metzner
Member

Posted 12-Feb-2005 10:22 AM
One reason why the term "CRM" has been widely discredited is that no one really knows what it is. Is it sales force automation? Contact center management? Marketing datamart? All of these things?

The extent to which CRM has been discredited is due to its overuse; CRM became the next best thing, and companies jumped on the bandwagon, terming their applications as CRM regardless of what they did.

Because of this, we have termed what we do as "building loyalty in the post-CRM world." Regardless of what people think of CRM, they relate to our concept, because of the disappointment of so many at their investments in CRM.

Many companies with expensive CRM installations now have lots more data, but no more, and maybe less, actionable information. What drives customer behavior has not changed; what has changed are the tools available to we practitioners to maximize the value of our customer relationships. Too many people confuse the enabler of CRM for an end in itself.

We've expanded on our thoughts in the article section of our site, [URL=www.metzner-schneider.com].

Edwin Setzpfand
Member Council
Member

Posted 18-May-2005 08:08 AM
Bob,

In response to your question about choosing an alternative name to replace "CRM":

From CRMGuru's Mission (as on the Home page)

"To help marketing, sales and service executives succeed with Customer Relationship Management (CRM), through high-quality and unbiased CRMGuru.com articles, discussions, newsletters and online events; interactions with CRMGuru panelists; insightful industry benchmark reports; and an annual thought-leader event."

and also taking into consideration that so many post on this forum questions like "What is CRM?", "I need help to write a thesis about CRM", "Is there a difference between CRM and ...?" or "How do I start with CRM?"

.. I think that we should stick with the "classical" terminology and abbreviation.

Replacing "CRM" with another name has a large chance of creating a lot of misunderstanding and further confusion which even might result in more "bad press" for the concept and ideas of C-R-M (whatever way you want to call it).

Although the issue of bad press is not a #1 issue this forum should address, I think we should give it considerable attention.

To take a point from Richard's contribution "CRM .. no one really knows what it is" and the alternative CRM-names as in Bob's initial contribution:

Couldn't we on this forum build a collection of the most widely used "CRM-alternatives" and their meaning? Not to choose one as an alternative term, but (as in the above Mission) to initiate "interactions" as "[help to marketing, sales and service executives to succeed with CRM]", whatever term they choose to use.

Edwin

Virendra Gandhi
Member

Posted 28-May-2005 05:04 AM
To carry on with this discussion (even though it is too late for the summit) isn’t it that without business there can be no customers and CRM is all about managing customers for the business. So why not call it the "Business enabling systems" or Customized Business Enablers. And even if we want to "stick-to-the-old-term" approach (meaning our old ways) it’s great, but we owe it to "our" customers and ourselves to try newer things, one such thing could be the baseline from where each can go their own directions. Maybe I am digressing but so be it. The initiative taken for setting up standards could be first step in the right direction (I believe it is). There has to be a common environment for all from where, further tailor-made software could be integrated. This way the users will become used to it without the necessity of being retrained with a change of job irrespective of the supply chain whether they new job is with a supplier’s supplier or customer’s customer making the adoptability problem a lot easier. Maybe this can be taken this up for discussion during the summit.

Richard puts "it no one really knows what it (CRM) is? True we are all like the blind people who wanted to know what an elephant is? So when taken to one, the first person felt the elephant’s trunk he described the elephant as a long round pipe, the second one felt it’s legs so he described the elephant as something like a tree trunk, the third felt it’s tail and he described it as a slithering serpent or a thin rope.

The point is nobody seems to have the whole picture. The vendors, developers, et all have one thing in common they certainly want to help and really make it the next big thing, but are still groping around.

You say CRM is dead and if it is, it has to resurrect in a new avatar, hopefully the second coming will be more adoptable, and acceptable as it has the potential of being the next big thing.

Jaye
Member

Posted 02-Jun-2005 01:17 PM
There are two comments above that seem to be pivotal in not only the immediate discussion but in also the underlying concept, the first of which is, "The point is nobody seems to have the whole picture."

I don't believe the point is to have the whole picture of this newly fading phoenix of business approaches or the tools used to monitor history, trends, and predictions. The point might well be to solidify one's own grasp and application. I don't believe there could ever be a successful engraved-in-stone "rule" which is what seemingly caused the downfall of "CRM." Too many grasped desperately at that too early, and when it didn't meet or exceed (unreasonable?) expectations perhaps, it toppled from hallowed graces. Its rigidity and control, both in title and concept, prevented it from adapting to the one business epiphany that still rings true, the second quote, ""What drives customer behavior has not changed."

Needs are still needs, and wants are still wants, and the balance of supply and demand as well as profit and loss are still quite happily alive, tyvm.

What I've used isn't "Customer Relations Management" but "Customer-Business Interrelations Platform." It acknowledges all four cornerstones of business; it allows adaptability to and prediction of market trends, whether "I" am the business or a BTB customer; and it's allowed use and growth not just management.

Gwynne Young
Managing Editor, CustomerThink
Member

Posted 04-Dec-2006 08:48 AM
Guru Dick Lee in his lead article, Is It the Beginning of the End for CRM or the End of the Beginning?, argues that there's no reason to get rid of CRM for any other three-letter abbreviation, provided organizations really focus on having a customer-centric strategy.

Reading the other posts here, I tend to think that the important thing isn't what you call it, it's what you do. Call it CRM. Call it CEM. But don't just rely on technology to fix what's broken in your company. Listen to your customers. Be a customer. Be customer-centric.

What do you think?

Vladimir Dimitroff
Member

Posted 04-Dec-2006 10:08 AM
Spot on! (And great opening slides Smile )

The software industry will continue to call CRM what they believe it is, and they will continue to exercise the brainwashing power of their Sales and Marketing to make a lot of business decision-makers think the same. I've got used to this fact, just as I got used to the fact that Microsoft rules the world (well, almost).

But this is exactly what will make the big difference between winners and losers—not just in 'CRM' (whatever it means to them), but in business in general.

To highlight the fact that CRM is alive and evolving, I blogged about (what I called) 'CRM 2.0'—using with more than a pinch of irony the analogy with 'Web 2.0' hype-of-the-day. I can reiterate that, like all organic and fundamentally-rooted business concepts, CRM is evolving with the times and the evolution of business and society. CRM 2.0 (if there is such a thing at all) is not a revolutionary 'quantum leap', but yet another step forward from CRM 1.9—and there are more steps to come.

Tom Siebel is just the most visible among many who we've heard pronounce CRM dead, even on this community site. In his case he just meant 'CRM as defined by Siebel'. RIP !

Vladimir Dimitroff
PRISM Consulting (UK)
vdimitroff@prism-gb.com

Graham Hill
Guru
Member

Posted 04-Dec-2006 11:01 PM
If only we spent a little of the time we waste on the meaningless "naming of parts", on making those very same parts fit together properly and work to create value.

If you look back, you see that suprise, suprise, just like everything else in life, that CRM evolves.

It started back in the 1950s (not the 80s) with Lester Wundermann's development of direct marketing. This supported the advertising-driven post-war growth of many fast moving consumer goods. It evolved in the 1980s/early 1990s into software + IT consultant driven orgy of corporate spending. But many customers were left behind in the process. It then evolved again in the late 1990s/early 2000s to become the more customer-focussed CEM. It should be no suprise that this coincided with the expansion of the customer-in-control Internet into many homes. It is now evolving again to bring customers inside companies in Customer-driven Co-creation.

CRM will continue to evolve as the economic environment changes. None of the earlier evolutionary stages will disappear, instead, they will be simply built upon as CRM expands the range of tools and techniques at its disposal. Direct marketing is doing almost as well today as when Lester Wundermann did his first catalogue mailing all those years ago. And CRM software continues to be a multi-billion dollar industry.

So lets move on from the naming of parts to the creation of value; for customers, for employees and for shareholders. Surely, that is what sustainable business is all about.

Graham Hill